Unchained

The CFTC reclassified perps as futures. Katherine and Jessi parse what the ruling actually permits and what it means for Hyperliquid. Plus: if your AI agent gets scammed, who pays? Thanks to our sponsor! Explore crypto careers that could change your future at https://crypto.fidelitycareers.com The CFTC approved a perpetual Bitcoin futures contract for KalshiEX, and crypto Twitter immediately got it wrong. Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos untangles what actually changed, why the switch from swap to futures classification matters for retail access, and what the ruling leaves wide open on leverage and decentralized exchanges. Jessi Brooks and Katherine explore the fact that AI agents can now place orders, not just give advice. They revisit their paper "The Agents at the Gate" and make clear why Robinhood's move to let agents charge your Gold Card raises liability questions that existing consumer protection law was never built to answer. In the strangest segment, they also dug into a New York lawsuit where an anonymous plaintiff is claiming legal ownership of nearly 40,000 dormant crypto wallets. Jessi explains why the lost-property theory will probably fail — and why even a partial win could force centralized exchanges into an impossible spot. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Strategy sold BTC. Can its preferred dividend stack survive without Bitcoin growing at least 11.5% year? Plus, they cover Jamie Dimon calling Brian Armstrong “full of shit.” --- Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Strategy sold Bitcoin for the first time since 2022 — 32 BTC to cover preferred stock dividends. Ram, Austin, and Chris discuss whether that small sale signals a deeper structural tension between equity holders, preferred holders, and Bitcoin itself. They also covered the news that Anthropic filed for an IPO at a valuation approaching $1 trillion. The hosts lay out the bull and bear cases  and ask whether retail investors can realistically get a 10x out of a company already priced like a finished product. Unpacking a spicier moment, they also discussed the moment when JPMorgan’s Jamie Dimon called Coinbase’s Brian Armstrong “full of shit” on live TV over the Clarity Act. Ram says crypto's window of peak political power is closing fast, while Austin gives crypto lobbyists a great idea for how to turn the banks’ stablecoin yield crusade against them. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell — Founder, Zero Knowledge Consulting; Adjunct Professor, NYU Stern ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Steve Sosnick on the ratchet effect in equities, the AI bandwidth parallel, Kevin Warsh’s impossible first week, and why crypto is the unsexy trade right now. --- Thank you to our sponsor! Coinbase: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at coinbase.com/unchained. Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Equities are near all-time highs, the Fed’s preferred inflation gauge just hit a multi-year peak, Iran ceasefire talks are producing a familiar ratchet effect in markets, and Bitcoin is quietly underperforming tech stocks on a nine-month volatility low. Steve Sosnick, chief strategist at Interactive Brokers, joins Steve Ehrlich to map what’s actually driving these unique market dynamics. They cover the two vulnerabilities that could change things, the uncomfortable parallel between today’s AI capex and the 1999 bandwidth buildout, what $120 billion in money market inflows says about where retail cash is actually sitting, the challenge Kevin Warsh faces walking into an already-skeptical FOMC, and why crypto is currently losing the competition for momentum-chasing money to AI stocks, upcoming IPOs, and even a memory chip ETF. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steve Ehrlich, Head of Research at SharpLink and Host of Bits + Bips: The Interview - https://x.com/Steven_Ehrlich Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steve Sosnick — Chief Strategist at Interactive Brokers Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A co-founder of OpenZeppelin said he’s urging friends to exit blue chip DeFi. Isaac Patka and Mike Silagadze explain what he got right, what he got wrong, and what needs to change. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. ======================================================== A co-founder of OpenZeppelin set off a firestorm on Crypto Twitter this week by declaring that he now considers all of DeFi unsafe, citing superhuman AI coding agents and the asymmetry between attackers and defenders.  Isaac Patka, certifications lead at Security Alliance, and Mike Silagadze, CEO of Ether.Fi, join Laura Shin to push back on that framing — and to make the case that the real problem isn’t AI finding sophisticated zero-days, it’s that 90% of hacks are still embarrassing opsec failures.  They cover the full threat taxonomy: opsec and parameter mistakes, contagion from bridge failures, AI-enabled social engineering, and the decentralization theater that leaves protocols unable to protect their own users.  Mike makes a pointed argument for why every serious DeFi protocol needs a hard pause button and a blacklist mechanism, while Isaac explains the three-multisig architecture that should be the minimum standard. Plus, both lay out the practical question every user should ask before putting money into any protocol. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠Isaac Patka (@isaacpatka) — Certifications Lead at Security Alliance & Co-founder of Shield3 ⁠⁠⁠⁠Mike Silagadze (@MikeSilagadze) — CEO of Ether.Fi Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Illia Polosukhin, founder of NEAR and co-author of 'Attention Is All You Need,' on why confidentiality will let crypto become daily commerce — plus, some Near lore. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! ⁠⁠Multichain Advisors⁠⁠: Get help navigating TGEs, go‑to‑market, BD and partnerships, capital markets advisory, PR, media placements, KOL activations and more at ⁠⁠multichainadv.com⁠⁠. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. ======================================================== Before co-founding NEAR Protocol, Illia Polosukhin was on the eight-person Google Brain team that wrote the transformer paper — the architecture behind every large language model running today. He never mentioned it. When Kain Warwick found out two weeks ago, via a crypto AI chatbot, his reaction was: you have to be kidding me. That backstory sets the tone for a conversation that moves from how transformers actually came together, to why confidentiality is what unlocks on-chain commerce for real businesses, and what NEAR is doing to keep criminals off its network without becoming a surveillance layer. The hosts also get into the Ethereum Foundation's identity crisis, why Illia thinks decentralization is a tool and not a goal, and what the economy looks like when AI handles execution and blockchain handles coordination. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Luca Netz⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, CEO of Pudgy Penguins Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Illia Polosukhin — Co-Founder, NEAR Protocol - https://x.com/ilblackdragon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Vitalik finally said ETH the asset matters. Zak Cole’s reaction: ‘Should have said that five years ago.’ What broken cryptoeconomics mean for Ethereum’s future. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠. ======================================================== The Ethereum Foundation has lost a wave of senior people in the span of a few months. A new co-executive director nobody has ever met is cutting budgets and releasing documents with a certain aesthetic. Vitalik published a post saying ETH the asset is the most high-value product of the blockchain. And David Hoffman sold his last ETH. Zak Cole, president of the Ethereum Community Foundation, and Greg Markou, co-founder of Sprinter and ChainSafe, join Laura Shin to sort through what’s a bear market tantrum, what’s a structural failure, and what would actually need to change for Ethereum to stop ceding ground to its competitors. The conversation covers the CROPS mandate, the rumored loyalty pledge, broken cryptoeconomics, and what Zak says the EF still refuses to admit. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠Zak Cole - Managing Partner, Number Group; President, Ethereum Community Foundation ⁠⁠⁠⁠Greg Markou - Co-founder and CEO, Sprinter; Co-founder, ChainSafe Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ethereum's midlife crisis hits the podcast as ex-Bankless and ConsenSys insiders unpack ETH's talent exodus, identity spiral, "Microsoft" future, EF shake-ups, and the Solana contender play-all with spicy takes on airdrops, real dev stats, and blockchain adoption drama. Welcome to The Chopping Block — where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, it's an Ethereum apostasy spectacular: we're joined by David Hoffman and Max Resnick, who hit the confessional booth to explain why they've left the church of Ethereum.  We kick off with David's viral "ETH is money" post-mortem: why he finally sold, and whether ETH can escape its spot on the yield farm for good. Max jumps in with an OG technologist's view on EF's internal struggles, talent flight, and the move-slow, break-nothing philosophy now gripping Ethereum's core. Is the EF just ossifying—or is it devolving into the "Microsoft of crypto"? From there, the hosts dissect the "second foundation" meme, why Twitter doomers might not matter for the ETH price, and whether Solana has stolen the next generation of devs. Max throws down on Solana's quantum future while the group takes barstool shots at metrics, narratives, and the never-ending "Ethereum is for boomers" debate. Whether you're a ride-or-die Etherean or just here for the schadenfreude, let's get into it. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹David Hoffman reveals why he sold all his ETH and stepped down from the "ETH is money" pulpit 🔹Max Resnick on Ethereum's talent drain, EF's slow tech culture, and missing the Wall Street on-chain boat 🔹Why the Ethereum Foundation's leadership shuffle triggered so much existential dread 🔹The "Ethereum is Microsoft" thesis: ossification, enterprise comfort, and is that a bad thing? 🔹Are airdrops, stablecoin and NFT on-chain metrics just smoke and mirrors? 🔹Developer mindshare —did Solana peak? Has ETH truly lost the next-gen builders? 🔹Will a new "Number Go Up Foundation" for Ethereum change anything? 🔹Solana's post-quantum roadmap: why Max thinks ETH is over-complicating the problem 🔹What happens if Ethereum stops shipping upgrades —

Banks are about to lose two of their biggest advantages: custody and payments. A new White House EO opening Fed master accounts to fintechs could be the catalyst. Thanks to our sponsor! Coinbase One Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan ⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠ A White House executive order is pushing the Fed to open its master account system to fintechs and crypto firms, and the implications are bigger than most people realize. Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos, Jessi Brooks, and Vy Le trace what it would mean to plug crypto directly into the core plumbing of the US dollar system, why traditional banks should be furious, and where the guardrails are missing. They also dig into the NYT’s scathing CFTC piece and whether the snark undermines the serious allegations. Plus the SEC's delayed innovation exemption, Commissioner Hester Peirce's departure, and the White House AI EO that collapsed in eighteen hours. Jessi maps the four White House factions fighting over AI governance, and argues crypto's "don't trust, verify" model is exactly the accountability layer AI needs. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TuongVy Le⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Veda Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Citadel and SIFMA lobbied to slow tokenized equity rules. Arjun Sethi calls it 'corporate plumbing.' Chris Perkins calls it a bond future moment. --- Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠. Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Kraken has spent $2.75 billion on acquisitions in the past year, and co-CEO Arjun Sethi says the point is not a bigger exchange. The goal is a 24/7 global operating system for capital markets: spot, derivatives, payments, tokenized equities, and custody under one regulatory stack. Sethi makes the case for each move, from REAP's tripling revenue in emerging markets to Bitnomial's CFTC trifecta, and says what will actually drive Kraken's next three years is not trading volume. The conversation then turns to the SEC's paused innovation exemption for tokenized equities, why Citadel and SIFMA showed up to lobby against it, and whether direct listings on crypto rails could eventually replace Wall Street's IPO machine. The episode closes on a question nobody saw coming: what Pope Leo's first encyclical on AI and finance has to do with the Bitcoin white paper. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell (@austincampbell) — Founder, Zero Knowledge Consulting; Adjunct Professor, NYU Stern ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Guest: Arjun Sethi - Co-CEO of Kraken / Payward and Chairman of Tribe Capital Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Pre-IPO trading is hot ahead of three big IPOs. Perp volume on Hyperliquid went from $3M to $44M in three months, and SpaceX perps is just the beginning, says Dio Casares of Patagon. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠. ======================================================== Pre-IPO perp volume on Hyperliquid grew from $3 million to $44 million in roughly three months. Anthropic and OpenAI voided secondary shares, sending shockwaves through the pre-IPO marketes. Robinhood launched trust-style tokenized offerings into a gray area. And three trillion-dollar IPOs — SpaceX, Anthropic, and OpenAI — are converging in the same window. Dio Casares, founder and CEO of Patagon, a private neobank that has facilitated deals in Anthropic, xAI, Circle, and Kraken, explains the structural difference between derivatives and tokenized spot, why second and third-layer SPV waterfalls are legal hot potato, who actually holds the cleanest title, and where the competition for private market liquidity goes next. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠Dio Casares - Founder & CEO, Patagon Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Top Ethereum Foundation staff are leaving. Why? Also, Trade.xyz launched a synthetic pre-IPO SpaceX perp on Hyperliquid that further shows RWAs moving onchain. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠Multichain Advisors⁠: Get help navigating TGEs, go‑to‑market, BD and partnerships, capital markets advisory, PR, media placements, KOL activations and more at ⁠multichainadv.com⁠. ⁠⁠⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠. ======================================================== A synthetic SpaceX perpetual futures contract launched on Hyperliquid ahead of any IPO, jumping 44% before settling back down. Kain and Tay unpack what it means when a dress rehearsal for one of the biggest potential IPOs in years generates $33 million in trading volume. Then: the Ethereum Foundation exodus. Trent Van Epps, Josh Stark, Barnabé Monnot, Tim Beiko, and Carl Beek are out. Kain’s theory: longtime Ethereum “missionaries” were given hope for change under Tomasz Stanczak, only to see that momentum fade. Finally, three DeFi exploits in four days, including a Thorchain attack that Taylor reconstructed in real time using AI tools during incident response — ending with a fully working attack demo she never asked for. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Luca Netz⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, CEO of Pudgy Penguins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Kevin Warsh wants a smaller Fed balance sheet and fewer dot plots. Noelle Acheson says the bond market won't let him have either. Here's what she expects instead. --- Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Bond yields are climbing globally while stock markets push higher on AI optimism — and Noelle Acheson, author of the Crypto Is Macro Now newsletter, argues the divergence is not a contradiction but a warning. In her read, inflation was building before the Hormuz crisis, the BLISS trade has permanently replaced the TACO trade as the structural put under markets, and Kevin Warsh is walking into a Fed that the bond market controls more than he does. She also flags a contrarian indicator nobody is talking about: the gap between the cap-weighted S&P 500 and the equal-weight index is widening at a pace last seen in 1999. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steve Ehrlich, Head of Research at SharpLink and Host of Bits + Bips: The Interview - https://x.com/Steven_Ehrlich Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Noelle Acheson | Author, Crypto Is Macro Now newsletter Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

KK, Jessi, and Vy Le call out the silence from CoinDesk and industry organizations after the Consensus after-party was held at  E11even. Plus: Clarity’s odds. Thanks to our sponsor! Coinbase One Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan ⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠ The CLARITY Act cleared the Senate Banking Committee 15-9, but Katherine, Jessi, and Vy Le are not popping champagne.  KK puts passage odds at 35-40%. Vy Le came down from 90% after only two conditional Democratic votes out of committee. The ethics fight — whether any bill that leaves Trump family crypto holdings intact can get to 60 votes — remains the most credible blocker.  Meanwhile, WallStreetBets filed an SEC comment letter defending quarterly reporting that inadvertently makes the strongest case yet for why onchain transparency makes periodic disclosure obsolete. And the crew addresses the Consensus conference after-party, held at E11even, which features strippers: not a word from most of the trade organizations that claim to represent the industry. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TuongVy Le⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Veda Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Rebecca from Jito Labs joins Haseeb, Tom, and Tarun for a regulation deep-dive covering the CLARITY Act's stablecoin yield compromise and presidential ethics sticking points, CME and ICE's lobbying war against Hyperliquid's RWA perps, the prediction market legal battle heading to the Supreme Court, and whether the SEC's tokenized securities innovation exemption will actually matter. Welcome to The Chopping Block – where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, joining us is Rebecca Rettig, Chief Legal Officer at Jito Labs, who's here to help the crew make sense of the absolute regulatory tornado tearing through the industry. First up: the CLARITY Act. It just got out of Senate Banking Committee, but the road to passage is anything but smooth. The stablecoin yield fight with banks ended in a "do stuff yield" compromise, but presidential ethics provisions remain the last polarizing hurdle. Rebecca breaks down what actually changes for token founders if it passes — spoiler: not much immediately, since rulemaking alone could take years. Then: CME and ICE have declared war on Hyperliquid, lobbying the Hill to force CFTC registration on the decentralized perps giant. The crew debates who actually wins US regulated perps, whether Hyperliquid's pre-IPO markets represent a genuine threat to investment banking, and Rebecca introduces "on-chain finance" — a distinction the panel immediately roasts her for. Finally: prediction markets are in a legal bloodbath across state courts with a Supreme Court showdown likely by 2027, and the SEC's tokenized securities innovation exemption has Twitter buzzing but Rebecca skeptical. Let's get into it. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹 CLARITY Act Passes Senate Banking – Landmark crypto bill advances with bipartisan support, but presidential ethics provisions remain the final sticking point before a full Senate floor vote. 🔹 Stablecoin Yield Compromise – Banks screamed bloody murder, but the "do stuff yield" deal means transaction-based rewards are in and bank deposit lookalikes are out. 🔹 CME & ICE vs Hyperliquid – Traditional exchanges lobby Congress to force CFTC

USDC became Hyperliquid's stablecoin infrastructure, and the 30-year broke 5% for the first time since 2008. Austin, Ram, Chris, and Gordon Liao of Circle work through who wins. --- Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠Coinbase One⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠. Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Coinbase and Circle have moved into Hyperliquid, installing USDC as its aligned quote asset and taking over treasury and technical deployment. For Gordon Liao, Circle's Chief Economist and Head of Research, that is a liquidity supernova. For Chris Perkins, it is the moment every TVL-trapping platform was always going to arrive at.  Meanwhile, the CLARITY Act has cleared the Senate Banking Committee on a bipartisan vote, but the ethics question — whether Democrats will vote for a bill that leaves Trump's family holdings untouched — remains unresolved.  And as Kevin Warsh is confirmed as Fed chair, the 30-year yield breaks 5% for the first time since 2008. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell (@austincampbell) — Founder, Zero Knowledge Consulting; Adjunct Professor, NYU Stern ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Guest: Gordon Liao | Master of Coin, Circle Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

CME and ICE want regulators to rein in Hyperliquid, which delivers 24/7 derivatives markets that incumbents can't match. Can it be brought onshore? ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠⁠. ======================================================== CME Group and Intercontinental Exchange have asked the CFTC to regulate Hyperliquid, the offshore perpetuals exchange that has rapidly become one of the largest derivatives venues in the world. The incumbents argue that price discovery is migrating to unregulated territory. Hyperliquid argues that its onchain transparency makes it less susceptible to manipulation, not more.  Walt Lukken, president and CEO of the Futures Industry Association, and Chris Perkins, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management, sit down with Laura Shin to work through the options: come onshore and get the licenses, stay offshore and keep growing, or further decentralize until there is no entity left to regulate. The answer may reshape how global derivatives markets are built for the next decade. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: Walt Lukken | President & CEO, Futures Industry Association Chris Perkins⁠ | CEO, 250 Digital Asset Management Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The repo market is $16 trillion globally and most people have never heard of it — until the plumbing breaks. Craig Burchell of FalconX and Matteo Pandolfi of Pareto explain how it works and why bringing it on-chain is the next big unlock for DeFi. --- Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- The repo market is $16 trillion globally and it is, as Craig Burchell puts it, the oil that makes everything go. It is also almost entirely absent from on-chain finance — and that gap is creating real problems for RWA liquidity, stablecoin swap desks, and DeFi protocols trying to manage redemption queues. Steve Ehrlich sits down with Craig Burchell, head of lending at FalconX, and Matteo Pandolfi, CEO of on-chain credit infrastructure provider Pareto, to map exactly how repo works, what broke in 2019, why it translates extremely well into onchain finance. Matteo puts a $1 trillion figure on where on-chain repo gets in five years. Craig gives you one reason it gets there and one very honest reason it might not. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steve Ehrlich, Head of Research at SharpLink and Host of Bits + Bips: The Interview - https://x.com/Steven_Ehrlich Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Craig Burchell — Head of Lending, FalconX; previously Head of Lending at Membrane Finance. @_CraigBirchall ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Matteo Pandolfi — CEO & Co-Founder, Pareto (on-chain credit infrastructure). @pan_teo_ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Coinbase just became the official USDC treasury deployer on Hyperliquid. Alex Weseley of Artemis explains how this boosts Hyperliquid’s annual revenue by 25%. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠⁠Coinbase One⁠⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠⁠. ======================================================== The morning this episode was recorded, Coinbase announced it was acquiring the USDH brand and becoming the official USDC treasury deployer on Hyperliquid — a deal with $150 million in annual revenue implications for a platform that previously earned nothing from its $5 billion USDC float. Alex Weseley, institutional data lead at Artemis Analytics, walks through the math on the HYPE price move, explains why the deal had to be bilateral between Circle and Coinbase, lays out his $300 billion Coinbase thesis built on X402 and agentic commerce, and takes on the question Laura's been asking all week: is the Circle–Coinbase relationship heading for divorce? Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠Alex Weseley — Institutional Data Lead, Artemis Analytics Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Anthropic is voiding secondary market trades. Who gets hurt — WhatsApp scammers, Forge buyers, or the founders? Plus: why continuous synthetic pricing is coming for every pre-IPO company. Thank you to our sponsors!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Multichain Advisors: Get help navigating TGEs, go‑to‑market, BD and partnerships, capital markets advisory, PR, media placements, KOL activations and more at multichainadv.com. Coinbase: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at coinbase.com/unchained. Anthropic and OpenAI are moving to void secondary market trades — and Kain, Tay, and Luca think that's only going to work if they're serious about it, which means a lawsuit is probably coming. This week on Uneasy Money they trace the full anatomy of the pre-IPO SPV fraud wave, explain why synthetic perpetual markets will eventually price every in-demand private company continuously whether founders want it or not, and dig into the latest AI hacks. Tay breaks down how attackers are now using local on-device Gemini APIs to construct malware on the fly, and Kain shares the story of an agent that caught a slow-drain attack in 90 seconds that humans missed for 12 hours. Luca explains why Circle's Arc token is a brilliant move for Circle equity holders even if it changes nothing for ETH or Solana. Plus: the Aave/Kelp court update and why the Gerstein lawyers' argument that every victim needs to show up in court is fundamentally incompatible with how onchain recovery works. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Luca Netz⁠⁠⁠⁠, CEO of Pudgy Penguins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

As a new CLARITY Act draft dropped, KK, Vy, and guest Josh Riezman of GSR give their passage odds and explain the one developer protection provision that matters most. Thanks to our sponsor! Coinbase One Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan ⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠ A new draft of the CLARITY Act just landed — all 300-plus pages of it — and Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos, TuongVy Le, and guest Josh Riezman of GSR didn't wait to dig in.  On this episode they break down the specific developer protection provision in the Blockchain Regulatory Certainty Act that introduces a specific intent standard for charging developers, debate passage odds, and explain why Circle releasing a token as a public company signals a real shift in how the SEC thinks about the security/token distinction.  They also unpack Chair Atkins' remarks at the SEC's AI+ Expo — a speech Vy argues shows the SEC and Congress are now in lockstep on modernizing securities regulation for on-chain infrastructure — and why, for the first time, that infrastructure includes vaults. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TuongVy Le⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Veda Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh Riezman — Chief Legal and Strategy Officer, GSR Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ram says the entire market is now one giant AI trade. Chris argues the boom is backed by real fundamentals. Austin asks: is AI creating value for the right companies? --- Thank you to our sponsor! Coinbase One: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at coinbase.com/unchained. Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Circle just made history as the first publicly traded company to run a token presale, raising $222 million from BlackRock, Apollo, ICE, and a16z at a $3 billion valuation — and the stock went up. At the same time, Coinbase reported a $394 million loss, cut 700 jobs, and suffered a five-hour outage.  Ram, Austin, and Chris work through what's really happening: whether Circle's Arc is the institutional payment rail the industry has been waiting for or a financial engineering play, whether Coinbase's troubles are cyclical or structural, and whether the AI-driven market rally is a bubble forming or a fundamental shift that makes the dotcom comparison wrong. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell (@austincampbell) — Founder, Zero Knowledge Consulting; Adjunct Professor, NYU Stern ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Arthur Hayes sees one force driving markets right now: governments printing money to finance AI and war. He explains why that ends with Bitcoin much higher — and what could derail it. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! ⁠Coinbase One⁠: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at ⁠coinbase.com/unchained⁠. ======================================================== Maelstrom CIO Arthur Hayes called the Tehran toll booth scenario in writing — and now it's playing out. Sovereign nations are waking up to the fact that dollar assets don't buy oil when the strait is closed.  On this episode, Hayes joins Laura Shin to explain why the structural unwinding of petrodollar recycling forces the Fed to print, why an AI deflationary bust could rival 2008 in severity before central banks step in, and why that path ends with Bitcoin substantially higher.  He also breaks down his current highest-conviction positions: Hyperliquid, Zcash, and NEAR, and explains why he's deploying into what he calls maximum disillusionment in private crypto equity. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: Arthur Hayes — CIO, Maelstrom Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A legal battle over frozen KelpDAO hack funds is forcing DeFi to answer questions it has long avoided. Thank you to our sponsors!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Coinbase One: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at coinbase.com/unchained. Multichain Advisors: Get help navigating TGEs, go‑to‑market, BD and partnerships, capital markets advisory, PR, media placements, KOL activations and more at multichainadv.com. When the Arbitrum Security Council froze $71 million in funds tied to the KelpDAO  hack, it was hailed as vigilante justice. Now lawyers representing families of North Korea's victims are claiming that same money in a New York federal courtroom, as if theft transfers title.  Meanwhile, an AI agent running on Base got robbed via a prompt injection hidden in Morse code, and Coinbase cited artificial intelligence when announcing 14% layoffs.  Kain Warwick, Taylor Monahan, Luca Netz, and Kelsie Nabben, author of Decentralised Digital Security, work through what DeFi's security layer actually is, who gets to decide when to act, and whether any of it survives the arrival of autonomous agents. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Luca Netz⁠⁠⁠, CEO of Pudgy Penguins Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kelsie Nabben, Research Fellow at RMIT University — Author of 'Decentralized Digital Security: Code, Community, Crisis' (2025) Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Coinbase's chief policy officer explains why the bank lobby failed to kill stablecoin rewards — and what 'workable compromise' actually means for crypto users. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! Adaptive Security: Test and strengthen your company’s defenses against AI deepfakes and synthetic identities at adaptivesecurity.com.  Coinbase One: Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan at coinbase.com/unchained. ======================================================== The Genius Act established that stablecoin issuers could pay rewards to users. The banks said no. For months, the American Bankers Association used the Clarity Act as a pressure point to reverse that decision — tying up a bill that was supposed to govern an entirely different corner of crypto. Now there's compromise language. Coinbase's chief policy officer, Faryar Shirzad, says it's workable. The banks say it doesn't go far enough. Meanwhile, the Clarity Act itself is racing toward a July 4th deadline, with a Senate Banking Committee markup expected the week of May 14. Ethics provisions around government officials holding crypto assets remain the hardest open question — and, as Shirzad puts it, one entirely above his pay grade. This is where the biggest crypto legislation in US history actually stands. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: Faryar Shirzad (@faryarshirzad) — Chief Policy Officer, Coinbase Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Seven lawsuits blame OpenAI for enabling a mass shooting. Could the same legal theory come for DeFi? Thanks to our sponsor! Coinbase One Get 20% off the first year of your Coinbase One annual plan coinbase.com/unchained Seven families just sued OpenAI in federal court, arguing ChatGPT was a defective product that helped plan a mass shooting. OpenAI's own safety team flagged the risk eight months earlier and did nothing. The legal theory being tested here, that software developers can be held liable for foreseeable misuse of their tools, is the same theory that has been circling DeFi for years.  Meanwhile, April ended as the most hacked month in crypto history, with over $600 million stolen in roughly 30 exploits, most of them linked to North Korea and its weapons programs. DeFi United, a $300M relief coalition led by Aave, emerged as the industry's response.  KK, Vy, and Jessi unpack what it means when the 'code is law' defense starts to crack, why basic operational security is still not standard practice, and how close the Clarity Act actually is to crossing the finish line. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TuongVy Le⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Veda Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

From AI agents as economic actors to quantum threats and prediction market regulation, Ali Yahya of a16z lays out the investment thesis behind a16z crypto's fifth fund. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsor! Coinbase One 20% off first year of annual plan + $50 Bitcoin bonus. Offer valid until May 31. coinbase.com/unchained ======================================================== a16z crypto just closed its fifth crypto fund at $2.2 billion — smaller than its previous fund, but the firm says that's deliberate.  General Partner Ali Yahya argues we are entering a different phase of crypto's development: one where infrastructure is ready, regulatory clarity is arriving, and the competition for real users has begun in earnest.  Two themes sit at the center of a16z's thesis — the collision of crypto and FinTech, and the emergence of AI agents as economic actors. But Yahya's most striking claim may be about blockchains themselves: that performance is no longer a moat, privacy is. And that the chains which get privacy right will accrue stronger network effects than anything the industry has built before.  What does a world of privacy-dominant blockchains do to DeFi composability, to security, to the ability to track hackers? And where does the quantum threat actually stand? Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ali Yahya, General Partner, a16z crypto Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Missiles in the Strait of Hormuz. Brent jumps 5%. Bitcoin breaks through $80. The Bits + Bips crew reads the geopolitical tape — and explains why crypto is shrugging it off. --- Thank you to our sponsor! Coinbase One — coinbase.com/unchained Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Iranian cruise missiles struck commercial vessels in the Strait of Hormuz, Brent jumped 5%, and Bitcoin broke through $80 — all in the same day. The Bits + Bips crew unpacks what the escalation means for crypto and macro positioning, why Ram stays bullish, and whether Paul Tudor Jones is right that Bitcoin is now the best inflation hedge. They also break down the Clarity Act’s yield compromise — with Circle up 16% — and why Austin argues banks may have handed asset managers a structural win. Finally, a U.S. court filing targeting Arbitrum’s frozen North Korean funds raises a bigger question: can you serve legal papers on code, and what does that mean for DAO governance? Austin Campbell, Ram Ahluwalia, and Chris Perkins break it all down. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell (@austincampbell) — Founder, Zero Knowledge Consulting; Adjunct Professor, NYU Stern ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A prediction market trades on outcomes. An information market trades on knowledge. Fielding makes the case for the latter. --- Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- What if the biggest constraint on AI is not compute or data, but trust? Ben Fielding, CEO and co-founder of Gensys, spent years as a machine learning researcher before concluding that decentralized hardware was the only path to true scale, and that blockchain was the only technology that could make machines trust each other without human intermediaries. With the launch of Delphi, Gensys's onchain information market built on an OP stack L2, Fielding puts his theory to the test while making the case that prediction markets have been asking the wrong question all along, and that the long tail of markets no one has thought to create yet is where the real opportunity lies. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steve Ehrlich, Head of Research at SharpLink and Host of Bits + Bips: The Interview - https://x.com/Steven_Ehrlich Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ben Fielding, CEO & Co-Founder, Gensys @BenFielding Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

$606 million in DeFi exploits in one month. Two of the space's sharpest risk thinkers debate whether lenders are being paid anywhere close to enough. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! Coinbase One 20% off first year of annual plan + $50 Bitcoin bonus. Offer valid until May 31. coinbase.com/unchained Citrea Bitcoin changed how money works. Satya changes how Bitcoin scales. citrea.xyz/unchained ======================================================== One month, $606 million in exploits. And yet DeFi lending yields for blue-chip collateral sit close to SOFR, as if nothing happened.  Tom Dunleavy, head of venture at Varys Capital, did the math and concluded that fair risk-adjusted DeFi yields should sit around 12.5%. Adrian Cachinero Vasiljevic, co-founder of Steakhouse Financial, thinks that number paints with too broad a brush, and that for the right primitives, with the right collateral, the market rate might actually be close to correct.  Host Laura Shin queries them on the TradFi equations that underpin the debate, the DeFi-specific risks that those equations miss, and on whether depositors are sleepwalking into tail risk they cannot fully see. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠Tom Dunleavy, Head of Venture, Varys Capital — @dunleavy89 Adrian Cachinero Vasiljevic, Co-Founder, Steakhouse Financial — @adcv_ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Pump.fun set fire to $370 million in tokens. Luca lays out the airdrop math that says they should have done the opposite. Thank you to our sponsors!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ MultiChain Advisors is an emerging technology growth firm that has helped create $50B+ in enterprise value for 80+ clients over the past 4 years. They're the partner to help navigate markets.  Build real traction today at ⁠multichainadv.com⁠ Pump.fun had a choice with $370 million worth of its own tokens. It burned them. On this week’s Uneasy Money, Luca Netz argues that was the worst option on the table. He lays out the “people’s champ” math that, in his view, could have turned Pump.fun into a $5 billion-a-year business if Alon Cohen had launched the biggest airdrop crypto has ever seen—and bought the tokens back at the bottom. Kain Warwick and Taylor Monahan also dig into the 137,000 ETH community effort to plug the KelpDAO hole, why Tay thinks Aave—not Layer Zero or KelpDAO—is the key player in DeFi’s latest blowup, and Luca’s blunt new take on whether DeFi yield is even worth the risk right now. Plus: Meta paying creators in USDC, the ghost of Libra, and OpenAI’s leaked AI-native phone. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Luca Netz⁠, CEO of Pudgy Penguins Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Is the era of protocol bailouts upon us? The Chopping Block crew and MegaETH's Shuyao Kong debate Defi United’s community-funded rescue, the KPI vesting experiment shaking up token launches, whether DeFi yields truly underprice risk, and the first major PolyMarket insider trading bust—all delivered with the usual insider banter you won’t hear anywhere else. Welcome to The Chopping Block — where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, the squad is joined by MegaETH co-founder Shuyao Kong, fresh off their headline-making KPI-gated token launch. First, we dive into the whirlwind that is Defi United: a who’s-who of Ethereum OGs and protocols pledging hundreds of millions to fill bailout holes from the massive KelpDAO hack—voluntarily. Are we witnessing a new age of protocol do-gooder vibes or just kicking the moral hazard can down the road?  Then, we tear into the “are DeFi yields way too low” debate, prodded by Tom Dunleavy’s viral thread—should degens really be earning more for taking protocol risk, or are the markets just as weird as they seem? Shuyao gives us an under-the-hood look at MegaETH’s radical KPI vesting mechanics, why they made the token vesting play risky pre-TGE, and whether dynamic tokenomics could be the industry’s way forward (with plenty of banter about airdrop farming and governance theater along the way).  Finally, we spin through the saga of PolyMarket’s big DOJ insider trading bust: is “insider info” a feature or a bug in prediction markets? All that, history lessons, cynicism, and more—let’s get into it. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹 Defi United’s “bailout”—how a crowd-sourced effort filled the KelpDAO hack hole and melted crypto Twitter   🔹 Are protocol donations precedent-setting, a warning shot, or just vibes maxing?   🔹 Inside debates about moral hazard, socialized losses, and why kumbaya only works once   🔹 Surprising names (and missing ones!) from the bailout contributor list: Consensys, Mantle, Lido, Arbitrum, Circle, more   🔹 Why airdrop farmers sending dust is the most on-brand thing for crypto   🔹 The “are DeFi yields too low?” debate and why the true r

One side wins the OpenAI-Microsoft divorce, Ram calls a 19% earnings growth year 'bananas,' and Chris wants the US to hack back against DeFi exploiters. Here is the full rundown. --- Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on ⁠⁠⁠Apple Podcasts⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠YouTube⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠Spotify⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠X⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠Unchained⁠⁠⁠ and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- Chris Perkins and Ram Ahluwalia cover a lot of ground this week: Iran appears to be seeking a deal to end the Strait of Hormuz blockade as US economic pressure mounts, and the US government just worked with Tether to seize over $300 million in Iranian-linked stablecoins.  Bottoms-up S&P earnings estimates are running at 19% year-over-year growth, tech earnings are about to hit, and both hosts think the setup for markets is unusually constructive.  They also break down the new Microsoft-OpenAI agreement, the arrest of a special operations soldier for betting on the Maduro raid on Polymarket, and what the Kelp DAO hack means for DeFi's path to institutional adoption. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Microsoft restructured its agreement with OpenAI, and Ram Ahluwalia has a clear verdict: Microsoft won.  In this segment from Bits + Bips, Ram explains the three things Microsoft secured from the new deal, walks through the contract-breach context that shifted the negotiating leverage, and argues that Microsoft now holds a free call option on all of OpenAI's future model development, at no additional cost. Chris Perkins (@perkinscr97) — Co-Founder & Managing Partner, 250 Digital Asset Management Ram Ahluwalia (@ramahluwalia) — CEO, Lumida Wealth This clip is from a longer conversation on markets, tech earnings, DeFi security, and prediction markets. Full episode here: https://youtube.com/live/GE_847Xrj9E  We go live every Monday at 4:30pm ET — subscribe to catch it live. If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, X, Unchained and wherever you get your podcasts. 🔥 Apple Podcasts - https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/bits-bips/id1827931786 🔥 YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCuKiSkbYrUOOEEiYQEVPniQ 🔥 Spotify - https://open.spotify.com/show/6aSBMrOyi33aVDCULJ9mjN?si=NTLk-jl5QGeytA6-2kxMVQ&nd=1&dlsi=42f0b13dd53c4ba0 🔥X - https://x.com/bitsandbips 🔥 Unchained - https://unchainedcrypto.com/bitsandbips/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

People think of Aave and Morpho as competitors. But Morpho only lost $1 million when North Korea drained $300M from a DeFi protocol. The architecture explains why. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! Coinbase One 20% off first year of annual plan + $50 Bitcoin bonus. Offer valid until May 31. coinbase.com/unchained Citrea Bitcoin changed how money works. Satya changes how Bitcoin scales. citrea.xyz/unchained Ether.fi 15% cash back on food and ride apps, 3% on everything else. ether.fi/unchained ======================================================== After North Korea's Lazarus Group drained nearly $300 million from Kelp DAO's bridge, the contagion spread fast, leaving close to $200 million in bad debt on Aave. Morpho, one of the largest lending protocols in DeFi, ended up with about $1 million in exposure.  Paul Frambot, co-founder and CEO of Morpho, explains why the protocol's modular, isolated architecture produced a different outcome, and what it reveals about how DeFi lending is supposed to work.  He also addresses the ongoing debate over whether DeFi lenders are fairly compensated for risk, the institutional reaction to the hack and what it means for the sector's timeline, the moral complexity of Arbitrum's decision to freeze stolen funds, and why formal verification may be DeFi's last line of defense in an age of increasingly powerful AI. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠Paul Frambot, Co-founder and CEO of Morpho Labs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Luke Leasure and Shaunda Devens of Blockworks Research explain how three compounding failures, Kelp's one-of-one bridge signer, Layer Zero's permissive default settings, and Aave's failure to flag it as a collateral risk, set up the conditions for the exploit.  Shaunda Devens then breaks down the monolithic pool design that concentrated risk, showing how 98% of rsETH collateral was backing a single leverage looping strategy.  This clip is from a longer conversation on the Kelp rsETH hack and its implications for DeFi. Full episode here: https://youtube.com/live/hJ9X_btsvD0 We go live every Thursday at 12:00 PM ET — subscribe to catch it live. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

KelpDAO’s hackers left telltale signs pointing to one culprit, North Korea. Then, in a surprise move, the Arbitrum Security Council decided to fight back. ======================================================== Thank you to our sponsors! As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD.  You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security.  Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.   Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else.  Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card! Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer. Nexo is the premier digital wealth platform. Receive interest on your crypto, borrow against it without selling, and trade a range of assets. Now available in the U.S with 30 days of exclusive privileges.  Get started at http://nexo.com/unchained ======================================================== In this episode about the hack on KelpDAO that had a broad impact across all of DeFi, Miguel Morel of Arkham, explains what digital fingerprints made it clear North Korea was the likely hacker, plus how it is that Arkham’s users are using the platform to figure out how to get their bad debt out of Aave and when. Then Griff Green, a member of the Arbitrum Security Council, explains some of the reasoning that went into the decision to freeze $71 million of the funds stolen by DPRK, how the surprise move worked technically, and why blockchains are immutable only by social consensus — and how even Bitcoin could be changed by social consensus. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: Miguel Morel, CEO of Arkham Intelligence Griff Green, Arbitrum Security Council Member, Leader of the DAO Security Fund, Co-founder of Giveth Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The $300M KelpDAO exploit became a watershed moment for DeFi, and the Arbitrum Security Council voted froze $70M worth of stolen funds. Is this a slippery slope or learning from history? Thank you to our sponsors!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ MultiChain Advisors is an emerging technology growth firm that has helped create $50B+ in enterprise value for 80+ clients over the past 4 years. They're the partner to help navigate markets.  Build real traction today at multichainadv.com The largest DeFi hack of 2026 starts with an RPC node. Not a smart contract bug. Not a stolen key. A spoofed node and a forged transaction. And North Korea drained $300 million from Kelp DAO through LayerZero’s bridge in a single block. Then the attacker went to Aave, borrowed against assets that didn’t exist, and created a bad debt crisis that locked Kain out of his own position. That was Friday. By Sunday, North Korea had started laundering. By Tuesday, Arbitrum’s security council had done something no L2 has ever done: frozen $70 million of funds had stolen by upgrading a bridge contract mid-hack. Kain Warwick, Taylor Monahan, and Luca Netz, with guest Odysseas Lamtzidis, take apart every layer: the DVN architecture flaw, the Aave contagion, the circuit breaker debate, and why the ‘code is law’ era may have just quietly ended. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Luca Netz, CEO of Pudgy Penguins Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Odysseas Lamtzidis, Founder & CEO of Phylax Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A $300M bridge exploit is forcing the question DeFi has been avoiding: when users lose money, who is actually responsible — the protocol, the infrastructure provider, or both? Thanks to our sponsors! *⁠ As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD.  You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security.  ⁠Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at ⁠⁠citrea.xyz/unchained.⁠  *⁠ Nexo is the premier digital wealth platform. Receive interest on your crypto, borrow against it without selling, and trade a range of assets. Now available in the U.S with 30 days of exclusive privileges. Get started at http://nexo.com/unchained A $300 million bridge exploit at Kelp DAO has put DeFi's most uncomfortable question back on the table: when users lose money, who is actually responsible?  Katherine, Jessi, and Vy dig into the Kelp and Layer Zero finger-pointing and ask whether the industry's core values — permissionlessness, open composability — have become its greatest vulnerability.  Then: the Ninth Circuit heard oral arguments on prediction markets last week, and the panel's pointed questions signal the case is headed to the Supreme Court sooner than most expect.  Finally: American Express just solved three of agentic commerce's hardest problems — identity, mandate, and accountability — with a product that's live today. The crypto industry, which should be leading this race, is watching from the sidelines. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠TuongVy Le⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Veda Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Chopping Block crew and guest Monet Supply break down the $200M Kelp DAO bridge exploit, finger-pointing between LayerZero, Kelp DAO, and Aave, the wild “reverse hack” Arbitrum bailout, and what it all means for DeFi lending protocol risk, L2 trust, and the future of socialized losses in crypto. Welcome to The Chopping Block — where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, we’re joined by Monet Supply, DeFi governance OG and current Spark brain, for a front-row seat to crypto’s hack-of-the-week: the $200M “Kelp DAO—LayerZero—Aave” debacle. If you thought DeFi risk was just about liquidations, buckle up. The team untangles the hack mechanics, the musical chairs of collateral across bridges and lending markets, and—most importantly—the prime time blame game: is it LayerZero’s fault for running a single-signer bridge, or did Kelp DAO or Aave drop the ball? We dive deep into the “socialized losses” mess facing Aave depositors (especially on L2s), unpack Arbitrum’s extraordinary move to confiscate coins back from North Korea (yes, really), and debate whether rollups can—or should—aspire to Ethereum’s censorship resistance. Finally, the squad discusses concrete remediation: rate limits, portfolio triage on risky collaterals, and the meta-game of DeFi crisis response. If you want the blunt, unfiltered, and occasionally spicy take on DeFi’s latest chaos, let’s get into it. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹 Kelp DAO bridge exploit: $200M minted, North Korea fingered, DeFi lending protocols left holding the bag   🔹 Why LayerZero’s single-validator bridge design was a disaster waiting to happen   🔹 The Spider-Man meme comes to DeFi: KelpDAO, LayerZero, and Aave point fingers   🔹 Aave’s socialized losses headache: who eats the bad debt, L1 vs L2 depositors   🔹 Arbitrum’s Security Council “reverse hack” to claw back stolen ETH—feature or bug?   🔹 DeFi lending protocol design flaws, cascading risks, and pooled markets explained   🔹 Remediation: rate limits, fewer LRTs, and the “surface of death” in risk management   🔹 Rollups & L2s: why “Ethereum with training wheels” isn’t always the goal

Digital Asset’s CEO faces pointed questions about Canton’s core claims and admits something surprising about the network’s architecture. ======================================================== As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD.  You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security.  Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.   Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else.  Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card! Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer. ======================================================== Canton is the chain behind JPMorgan’s deposit token, DTCC, Broadridge’s $400 billion repo book, HSBC, Visa, and a growing roster of the biggest names in global finance. It describes itself as a public permissionless blockchain. But is it?  Yuval Rooz, co-founder and CEO of Digital Asset, faces off against Alex Gluchowski, co-founder and CEO of Matter Labs, and Dragonfly managing partner Haseeb Qureshi in a live debate.  The charges range from foundational: Canton cannot enforce financial rules without a trusted third party, its validators are permissioned in everything but name, and there is no universally shared ledger. Rooz fires back on all of it and, at one point, concedes something that may surprise you.  If the label matters as much as the technology, this episode will force you to decide what blockchain actually means, and whether that answer has consequences for the institutions staking their infrastructure on it. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Yuval Rooz: Co-Founder & CEO, Digital Asset Haseeb Qureshi: Managing Partner, Dragonfly Alex Gluchowski: Co-Founder & CEO, Matter Labs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit <a

The $290 million Kelp DAO hack, attributed to North Korea's Lazarus Group, has DeFi TVL down $13 billion in 48 hours. Do DeFi's foundational assumptions need to change? --- Heads up! If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, X, Unchained and wherever you get your podcasts. ---- DeFi TVL fell from $99.5 to $86.3 billion in 48 hours after the $290 million Kelp DAO exploit — the latest nine-figure attack attributed to North Korea's Lazarus Group, this time via a compromised Layer Zero bridge.  Meanwhile, a new class of yield-bearing instrument is staking a claim on capital fleeing private credit: Apyx's APY USD, backed by Strategy's STRC preferred stock, launched on Kraken this week with a 12% yield target and $180 million in supply after just seven weeks. Is STRC-backed yield a legitimate financial primitive, or a Bitcoin derivative with extra steps?  And as DeFi absorbs yet another devastating security failure, is the industry's core assumption — that incoming transactions should be treated as legitimate — finally due for an overhaul? Austin Campbell, Ram Ahluwalia, and Chris Perkins dig in with Parker White of Apyx and Michael Bentley of Euler. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host of Bits + Bips, Zero Knowledge Consulting ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Parker White — @TheOtherParker_ — Founding Contributor, Apyx. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Michael Bentley — @euler_mab — Former CEO, Euler Labs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Bitcoin's spot-led rally looks healthy on the surface. But derivatives say conviction is thin. Josh Lim from FalconX on what the market structure is actually telling you right now. --- Thank you to our sponsors! MultiChain Advisors is an emerging technology growth firm that has helped create $50B+ in enterprise value for 80+ clients over the past 4 years. They're the partner to help navigate markets.  Build real traction today at multichainadv.com As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD.  You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security.  Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.  --- Bitcoin is trading near $75,000, but the market structure around it tells a more complicated story. Implied volatility has collapsed to sub-50, funding rates are negative, and the options market is dominated by sellers, not buyers. Meanwhile, Bitcoin miners are liquidating holdings to fund the transition to high-performance compute, generating a persistent offer just as breakeven retail holders look for an exit.  FalconX Global Co-Head of Markets Josh Lim joins Steve Ehrlich to map exactly what is keeping Bitcoin range-bound, where the rotation into ETH and alts is actually coming from, and what signals in derivatives and on-chain data would indicate the market is ready to move.  They also get into whether the Clarity Act changes the long-term structure of the altcoin market, how Hyperliquid is being used for institutional RWA arbitrage, and what the quantum threat means not for cryptography, but for trading Bitcoin. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steven Ehrlich⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Head of Research, SharpLink Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh Lim — Global Co-Head of Markets, FalconX. Repeat guest; previously covered market structure and institutional crypto flows on Bits + Bips. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Quantum computing risk, USDC vs. Tether drama after the Drift hack, and World Liberty Financial’s governance circus take center stage as Haseeb, Tom, Tarun, and special guest Joshua Lim dissect market signals, institutional FUD, Trumpcoin shenanigans, and ask: is crypto VC dead or just getting started? Welcome to The Chopping Block — where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, the crew is joined by special guest Joshua Lim, Head of Derivatives at FalconX (and self-described Quantum FUD Whisperer). Ever wondered what happens when a quantum computer finally threatens public key cryptography? We break down the real and imagined risks of “Q Day,” what markets are actually pricing in, and why watching for Satoshi’s coins moving is still the ultimate market panic trigger. Next up, the hosts tackle the messiest storyline in stablecoins: the massive Drift hack, North Korea’s role, and the blame game between USDC and Tether. Is Circle’s “wait for the court order” approach defensible, or are PR wins up for grabs for whoever moves fastest? We would never forget the crypto car crash that is World Liberty Financial: from drama-filled governance votes that magically extend lockups, to Justin Sun’s redemption arc versus Trumpcoin, to whale-scale DeFi leverage that could nuke a protocol. It’s a masterclass in governance theater and permissioned shenanigans. Finally, we level with all the “crypto venture is dead” crowd — who’s still building, where the real capital is now, and why bear markets always demand an extra shot of conviction. From quantum nightmares to meme coin melodrama, let’s get into it. Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform. Show highlights 🔹“Q Day” decoded: What quantum risk really means for Bitcoin and the markets   🔹 How institutional allocators cite quantum FUD — but are they just making excuses?   🔹 Why “watching for Satoshi’s coins moving” would nuke market confidence   🔹 Drift hack dissected: USDC vs. Tether, North Korea fingerprints, and Circle’s PR headache   🔹 Is Circle’s don’t-freeze-without-court-order policy defensible or just bad optics?   🔹 World Liberty Financial’s (Trumpcoin) greatest hits: f

Debanked 12 times. Walked through an airport in handcuffs. Every charge eventually gone. Nader Al-Naji on the defense strategy that convinced both agencies to back off. ======================================================== Nexo is the premier digital wealth platform. Receive interest on your crypto, borrow against it without selling, and trade a range of assets. Now available in the U.S with 30 days of exclusive privileges.  Get started at http://nexo.com/unchained ======================================================== In July 2024, Nader Al-Naji was preparing to board a flight to Turkey when the FBI arrested him in front of with his wife and son and walked him in handcuffs through the airport.  The DOJ and SEC had jointly charged the DESO and BitClout founder with defrauding investors of $3 million and running an unregistered securities offering. Twenty months later, both cases are gone: the DOJ dismissed in March 2025, the SEC dismissed with prejudice — meaning it can’t be refiled — in March 2026.  Nader tells Laura what actually happened, from the FBI raid on his Beverly Hills home and the clerical error that sent him to federal prison for a weekend, to the legal strategy that convinced both agencies to back off. He also revisits the BitClout celebrity era, the long call with Do Kwon before Terra launched, and the debanking tactic he calls ‘subpoena sniping.’ Host: ⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Nader Al-Naji (@nadertheory), Founder of DESO and BitClout Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

A Bitcoin developer just proposed freezing wallets that don't upgrade for quantum resistance. Including Satoshi's. Thank you to our sponsors!⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Nexo Nexo is the premier digital wealth platform. Receive interest on your crypto, borrow against it without selling, and trade a range of assets. Now available in the U.S with 30 days of exclusive privileges.  Get started at http://nexo.com/unchained Multichain Advisors MultiChain Advisors is an emerging technology growth firm that has helped create $50B+ in enterprise value for 80+ clients over the past 4 years. They're the partner to help navigate markets.  Build real traction today at multichainadv.com Citrea  Bitcoin’s application layer, Citrea, launched its mainnet, expanding Bitcoin’s utility to privacy, lending, BTC yields, and more. Citrea enables: cBTC: The first trust-minimized Bitcoin on a fully programmable platform. ctUSD: A native stablecoin for Bitcoin, allowing for unified liquidity. Bitcoin Capital Markets bringing demand, and utility to the Bitcoin Network. Explore the Citrea Ecosystem. A Bitcoin developer just proposed the unthinkable: freeze every wallet that does not upgrade for quantum resistance, including Satoshi's.  Kain Warwick and Taylor Monahan are here to reckon with BIP-361, the quantum threat to early Bitcoin addresses, and what it means that this proposal exists at all. They also work through who actually wrote Bitcoin — Hal Finney, Adam Back, and Dave Kleiman — and a trail that runs through the Epstein files.  Plus: Justin Sun's frozen World Liberty Financial tokens expose why token holders have no legal rights, EtherFi's exit from Scroll turns into a live platform risk case study, and Circle's decision not to freeze known stolen USDC raises the question of what stablecoin issuers owe to the ecosystem. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Founder of Infinex and Synthetix ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Security Expert Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Can a private company be trusted to decide which 40 firms get access to the world’s most dangerous AI model? And separately — is the SEC’s new Reg Crypto finally the framework the industry has been waiting for since 2020? Thanks to our sponsors! *⁠ As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD.  You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security.  Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.  *⁠ Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else.  Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card! Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer. The week StarkWare’s chief product officer published a paper proposing a quantum-resistant mechanism for Bitcoin that doesn’t require changing Bitcoin’s code. The crew discuss the the threat quantum computers pose to bitcoin, which raises philosophical questions about what it means to “own” bitcoin. “Not your keys, not your coins” has long been the catchphrase — so what happens if a quantum computer wrests your keys away fro you? Plus they discuss the fact that Anthropic decided not to release its most powerful model to the public at the same time its technology is being removed from the government. What does it mean when a private company has greater capability than the U.S. government?   Also, the SEC’s Division of Trading and Markets quietly released major guidance clarifying when DeFi front ends need to register as broker-dealers — and Chair Atkins announced what could become the first actual crypto rulemaking in the agency’s history.  Katherine, Jessi, and TuongVy work through what each of these developments means for builders, lawyers, and founders navigating crypto right now — and why the question of who gets to make these calls is the same whether you’re talking about AI or regulation. Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠, General Counsel at StarkWare. Previously held senior legal roles across DeFi and centralized exchanges. ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital <p

The US Naval blockade is live, markets are holding, and Ram thinks the bottom is in. Austin and Chris are not so sure. --- Thank you to our sponsors: Citrea  As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD.  You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security.  Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.   Etherfi Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else.  Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card! Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer. Nexo Nexo is a premier digital wealth platform offering: ● crypto yield up to 15% (based on stated annual interest rates) ● crypto-backed credit lines from 1.9% ● a wide range of digital assets.  Join today and get 30-day access to exclusive rates. Join Nexo. ---- The day the US Naval blockade of the Strait of Hormuz went live, peace talks had just collapsed in Islamabad and markets were holding. Ram, Austin, and Chris work through the tactical logic behind CENTCOM’s move, why regional powers are standing down, and how long Iran can sustain the economic pressure.  Then: Anthropic previewed a model called Mythos, cybersecurity stocks fell, and the question of whether AI security risk is real or manufactured now has real money behind it.  Meanwhile, World Liberty Financial borrowed $75 million against its own governance token on a platform co-founded by its own advisor, Justin Sun is accusing the team of treating investors as a personal ATM, and the stablecoin bill clock is ticking.  Which sectors are most dislocated? What would it take to bring the next wave of investors into crypto? And is this actually a market bottom? Hosts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host of Bits + Bips, Zero Knowledge Consulting ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO

The basis trade paid 15–30% near risk-free for years. Options couldn't compete. Then 10/10 happened. ======================================================== As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD. You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security. Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.   Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else.  Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card! Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer. ======================================================== For years, the basis trade and token-launch points farming crowded out options as a yield tool in crypto — not because options were inferior, but because the alternatives were simply too easy and too lucrative.  That changed on 10/10. With the basis trade effectively dead and altcoin valuations cratered, a window has opened for onchain options to compete for capital in a way they never could before.  Nick Forster, CEO of Derive (formerly Lyra), has been building toward this moment for five years. He joins LTR, venture investor at Cosmos, who has tracked the full graveyard of failed options DEXes — Opyn, HEGIC, Ribbon, Dopex, Strike — and still believes this time is different. The question isn't whether crypto options will scale. It's whether the infrastructure is finally ready. Host: ⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠, Host / Unchained Guests: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Nick Forster, CEO and Founder, Derive ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠LTR, Venture Investor, Kosmos Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Why ETH outperformed Bitcoin this past week, what's really behind the prediction market activity during the Iran situation, and what comes next for institutional crypto adoption. --- Thank you to our sponsors! Ether.fi — 15% cash back on food and rideshare apps, 3% on everything else, borrow at 4% or less Citrea — Trust minimized BTC, native stablecoin CT-USD, Bitcoin capital markets --- A tenuous Iran ceasefire sent oil prices tumbling this past week, and crypto responded before any other asset class. Bitcoin climbed to around $72K, Ethereum outperformed with 6.7 to 7% gains in 48 hours, and billions poured back into ETFs after months of withdrawals.  But amid the rally, uncomfortable questions are surfacing: who profited from suspicious prediction market bets placed just before the ceasefire announcement? Are Middle Eastern governments and corporations now using Bitcoin as actual settlement infrastructure? And if the Clarity Act passes without allowing yield-bearing stablecoins, has the banking lobby won?  Kavita Gupta, founder and general partner at Delta Blockchain Fund, sits down with Steven Ehrlich to work through a week of whipsawing markets, fragile geopolitics, and structural shifts that could define where crypto goes from here. Host: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steven Ehrlich⁠⁠⁠⁠, Head of Research, SharpLink Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kavita Gupta, Founder & General Partner at Delta Blockchain Fund Links: Ceasefire, Markets & Institutional Flows: Crypto Markets Rebound After Iran-Israel Ceasefire Deal (Unchained) Bitcoin ETFs Record $5 Billion in Daily Volume as Inflows Top $870 Million (Unchained) Crypto Adoption in MENA 2025: Crisis, Adaptation, and Growth (Chainalysis) Prediction Markets & Insider Trading: DEX in the City: Why Prediction Market 'Insider T

James Seyffart didn't expect Morgan Stanley to do this. Now he's watching to see if BlackRock blinks. Nexo is the premier digital wealth platform. Receive interest on your crypto, borrow against it without selling, and trade a range of assets. Now available in the U.S with 30 days of exclusive privileges.  Get started at http://nexo.com/unchained Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else.  Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card! Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer.  Bitcoin’s application layer, Citrea, launched its mainnet, expanding Bitcoin’s utility to privacy, lending, BTC yields, and more. Citrea enables: cBTC: The first trust-minimized Bitcoin on a fully programmable platform. ctUSD: A native stablecoin for Bitcoin, allowing for unified liquidity. Bitcoin Capital Markets bringing demand, and utility to the Bitcoin Network. Explore the Citrea Ecosystem. ======================================================== When Morgan Stanley launched MSBT this week, it didn't just become the first major US bank to issue its own spot Bitcoin ETF — it became the cheapest one on the market, undercutting BlackRock's iBIT by 11 basis points. For a firm not known for fee competition, that surprised even close ETF watchers.  James Seyffart, senior analyst at Bloomberg Intelligence, has spent years tracking how wirehouses have slowly warmed to Bitcoin products. He joins Laura Shin to discuss what MSBT's launch says about where institutional crypto adoption is heading, whether Morgan Stanley's 16,000 advisors and $7 trillion in assets could meaningfully shift flows, and why Seyffart now sees inaction on crypto as the active choice, not the safe one, for portfolio managers.  Plus: Strategy's $14.5 billion loss, Saylor keeps buying, and why MSTR’s S&P 500 question is now entirely a Bitcoin price story. Host: ⁠Laura Shin⁠, Host / Unchained Guest: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠James Seyffart, Senior Analyst, Bloomberg Intelligence Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices