About this episode
Henry Shukman (Ryu’un-ken) is an Associate Zen Master of the Sanbo Zen lineage, based in Kamakura, Japan. He has trained primarily with Joan Rieck Roshi, Zen teacher John Gaynor, Ruben Habito Roshi, and now continues his training under the guidance of Yamada Ryoun Roshi, current abbot of Sanbo Zen. Henry is dedicated to what he sees as core Zen training—clarifying our essential nature to our own satisfaction, and thereby finding true peace of mind, and then living that essential nature in every moment of daily life, in freedom, love and deep responsiveness. As it happens, Mountain Cloud Zen Center was originally founded by a teacher whose training also took place within Sanbo Zen back in the 1950s, and Henry is the first Sanbo Zen teacher to have taught at Mountain Cloud since its founder. Henry is a writer and poet of British-Jewish origin, who has published eight books to date, of fiction, poetry and nonfiction. He writes regularly for Tricycle, The New York Times and other publications, and his most recent book is the poetry collection Archangel. He lives near the center in Santa Fe, New Mexico, with his wife Clare and their two sons. Henry adds, “At one point in our conversation I start to outline several “levels” of practice that have traditionally been outlined in zen. But partway through I slipped into another categorization of “wisdom levels” as given by Shinzen Young, a mentor of mine. I should have credited him. With apologies, I’m doing so now. Many thanks.” Earlier books: One Blade of Grass: Finding the Old Road of the Heart, a Zen Memoir The Lost City (Vintage Contemporaries) Savage Pilgrims In Doctor No's Garden The Lost Continent Discussion of this interview in the BatGap Community Facebook Group. Summary and transcript of this interview. Interview conducted October 12, 2019 YouTube Video Chapters: 00:00:00 - Introduction to Buddha at the Gas Pump 00:04:10 - A Brief Introduction and the New Book 00:07:37 - Finding Belonging in the Universe 00:11:54 - Emotional Wounds and Healing Journey 00:16:00 - Recalibrating and Finding Balance 00:19:55 - The Different Levels of Personal Psychology 00:24:16 - Discovering Zen Meditation 00:29:02 - Awakening through Different Senses 00:33:34 - Becoming Inseparable from All Phenomena 00:37:56 - The Importance of Having a Teacher 00:41:53 - A Shift in Perception and the Dissolution of Self 00:46:13 - The Marvel of Each Moment 00:50:06 - Humility and ongoing training in spiritual practice 00:54:22 - The Wall of Awakening 00:58:19 - Shifting to a Perspective of No Self 01:02:24 - The Importance of Multiple Valences in Practice 01:06:51 - Feeling Excluded in Pickleball 01:10:49 - Presenting the Koan 01:14:52 - Trusting the Process and the Yearning 01:18:59 - Awakening and Levels of Realization in Zen 01:23:06 - The Ten Stages of Zen Awakening 01:26:59 - The Beauty of Not Knowing 01:31:08 - Humility, Gratitude, and Compassion 01:35:11 - The Latent Energy of the Universe 01:39:40 - Falling into the Mystery 01:44:02 - The Cup Running Over 01:48:04 - Beings in the Buddhist Realm 01:52:17 - Finding the Hara in Zen Practice and What is Looking? 01:56:41 - The Importance of Teachers 02:01:12 - The Buddha with a small "b" 02:05:10 - Wrapping Up the Interview