June 4, 2025
Loosening the Knot: Rob Fisher on the Power of Therapeutic Relationships
Treated with Dr. Sara SzalAbout this episode
Rob Fisher is a marriage and family therapist (MFT), Hakomi trainer, professor, and author. After working in the entertainment industry, he began studying for his master’s degree in psychology. About a decade later, he discovered Hakomi—a body- and mindfulness-centered approach to psychotherapy that emphasizes experiential healing and the importance of the therapeutic relationship. Today, Rob has taught many therapists this practice and is developing “The Compassion Companion,” an AI tool powered by ChatGPT, for patients to use. Rob joins Dr. Sara on Treated to discuss what led him to switch careers, how he found Hakomi, why it’s such an important form of therapy, and what he’s learned about human nature through it. They also explore the power of writing and what inspired him to write both nonfiction and fiction books. Later, Rob shares his hopes and fears about AI and what the impact will be on human connection and in-person therapy. Dr. Sara tests out “The Compassion Companion,” Rob’s AI therapy tool, and they engage in a real-time Hakomi experience. To close, he shares a memory of one of his favorite clients and reflects on how he hopes to be remembered. // LEARN MORE FROM ROB FISHER // Visit his website robfishermft.com Check out the Compassion Companion and use it here . Purchase his book, The Weeping Buddha and Experiential Psychotherapy With Couples, A Guide for the Creative Pragmatist . // OTHER REFERENCES // Research studies on AI and psychotherapy: Kuhail, Mohammad Amin, Mohamed Bahja, Ons Al-shamaileh, Justin Thomas, Amina Alkazemi, and Joao Negreiros. "Assessing the Impact of Chatbot-Human Personality Congruence on User Behavior: A Chatbot-Based Advising System Case." IEEE Access PP (2024): 1-1. doi:10.1109/ACCESS.2024.3402977. // KEEP IN TOUCH WITH DR. SARA // If you have a question, leave a voicemail at speakpipe.com/treated Follow on IG: @saragottfriedmd @treatedwithdrsara Watch Treated on YouTube Produced by Dear Media . See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info .