#88 Wayne Turmel: Hybrid Work Is Not a Strategy—It’s a Hostage Negotiation

Wayne Turmel, co-author of The Long-Distance Leader , joins the show to unpack the chaos of remote and hybrid leadership. Is hybrid work really a strategy? Wayne says it’s more like a game of tug-of-war—companies push for office days, employees dig in their heels, and somehow three days in the office feels like a compromise nobody loves. He dives into how proximity bias sneaks into decision-making, why intentionality is the secret sauce for great leadership, and how balancing deep work with collaboration can save everyone’s sanity. Whether it’s giving feedback on time (without needing to see someone’s face) or managing your team across time zones, Wayne serves up leadership advice with wit, practicality, and just the right amount of Zoom fatigue relatability. Key Highlights of Our Interview: Lessons from History’s Leaders “Genghis Khan ruled half the world without a Webex meeting. Julius Caesar? Brilliant in the field, but the office politics got him. Leading from afar isn’t new—it’s just evolved.” The Proximity Bias Trap “In hybrid setups, those in the office often get more attention and opportunities—intentionally or not. Awareness is key to ensure fairness across the team.” Bridging the Trust Gap “Leadership tasks haven’t changed, but relationships, trust, and proactive communication now require a conscious effort to avoid gaps and micromanagement.” The Synchronous-Asynchronous Dance “Effective hybrid work balances synchronous collaboration with asynchronous deep work. It’s not about clocking in at the same time but about delivering results with flexibility.” Intentionality Over Chaos “Hybrid solutions require intentionality. Schedule in-office days for meetings and collaboration. Leave remote days for focused work. Let people own their time to produce quality results.” _________________________ Connect with us: Host: Vince Chan | Guest: Wayne Turmel Chief Change Officer: Make Change Ambitiously. Experiential Human Intelligence for Growth Progressives Global Top 3% Podcast on Listen Notes World's #1 Career Podcast on Apple Top 1: US, CA, MX, IE, HU, AT, CH, FI, JP 2.5 Millions+ Downloads 50+ Countries --Chief Change Officer-- Change Ambitiously. Outgrow Yourself. Open a World of Expansive Human Intelligence for Transformation Gurus, Black Sheep, Unsung Visionaries & Bold Hearts. EdTech Leadership Awards 2025 Finalist. 20 Million+ All-Time Downloads. 80+ Countries Reached Daily. Global Top 1% Podcast. Top 5 US Business. Top 1 US Careers. >>>180,000+ are outgrowing. Act Today.<<<