About this episode
Watch all of the day’s interviews: As we approach a full year of the Trump administration, the president has transformed the world order. Old institutions like NATO, the United Nations and the World Trade Organization are diminished, even in doubt, and the old trade regime and assumptions about alliances are gone. Relationships are transactional, and soft power is scoffed at. Traditional adversaries like Russia win praise, while there is talk about taking over Canada and Greenland. This is driven not only by those at the top but also by deep shifts to the right in electorates across the West, including in the Netherlands, Germany, Italy and elsewhere. Liberals and liberal values alike seem to be in retreat. Uncertainties dominate: How will China, North Korea and other nations respond to this new world order, and will they see it as an opportunity for adventurism? In this discussion, we asked: Where are we now? And what are the real-world ramifications of these policies, and are they lasting? Panelists: Ehud Barak, Former Prime Minister of Israel; Senator Chris Coons, Democrat of Delaware and a member of the Senate Committee on Foreign Relations; Mark T. Esper, Former U.S. Secretary of Defense; Avril Haines, Former U.S. Director of National Intelligence; David H. Petraeus, Partner at KKR, Chairman of the KKR Global Institute, Chairman of the KKR Middle East Global Institute New York and Former Director of the C.I.A.; Samantha Power, Former U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations and Former Administrator of the United States Agency for International Development; Fareed Zakaria, Host of “Fareed Zakaria GPS” on CNN Moderator: Nicholas Kristof, Opinion Columnist at The New York Times Filmed live at the 2025 DealBook Summit Subscribe today at nytimes.com/podcasts or on Apple Podcasts and Spotify. You can also subscribe via your favorite podcast app here https://www.nytimes.com/activate-access/audio?source=podcatcher . For more podcasts and narrated articles, download The New York Times app at nytimes.com/app.