About this episode
Ever since Trump was re-elected in 2024, his MAGA base has been eagerly awaiting the release of the Epstein files. So it came as a shock when, in July, a Justice Department memo said they had reviewed the matter and determined that there was “no basis to revisit the disclosure of those materials,” that the rumored “client list” did not exist, and that there was no evidence Epstein “blackmailed prominent individuals as part of his actions.” Suddenly, key pillars of the conspiracy theory were knocked down, by the very administration that promised to get to the bottom of the Epstein saga. Since then, MAGA has split into two factions: those who are siding with the administration and ready to move on, and those who still want the Epstein files released. To make matters worse for President Trump, recent stories in the Wall Street Journal have reminded the public that, for over a decade, Trump and Epstein were actually friends. And while it’s not evidence of a crime, recent reporting has also revealed that Trump’s name is, indeed, in the Epstein files. To help us separate the facts of the case from the thorny conspiracies that surround it, we’ve brought on Julie K. Brown and Donie O’Sullivan. Brown is an investigative reporter at The Miami Herald who began digging into the Epstein case in 2018, leading to his second arrest. O’Sullivan is a CNN senior correspondent who covers online misinformation and conspiracy theories. When reached for comment regarding allegations that it passed on the Epstein story, New York Times spokesperson Charlie Stadtlander responded with the following statement: The Times's coverage of Jeffrey Epstein has been hard-hitting and thorough, starting with the first legal charges against him in 2006. Since then, we've covered every step of the story involving Epstein, Ghislaine Maxwell, the powerful people in their orbit and the shadowy aftermath of Epstein's arrest and death in custody. We can't speak to whatever Julie K. Brown is saying the victims' lawyers told her -- neither of them has actually identified a New York Times journalist in this matter, and we have yet to find any record of such conversations. Times reporters continue to do tough and deep work to uncover and verify the facts about Epstein and those around him. Questions? Comments? Email us at on@voxmedia.com or find us on YouTube, Instagram, TikTok, and Bluesky @onwithkaraswisher. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices