About this episode
Is the US really in an AI race with China—or are we racing toward completely different finish lines? In this episode, Tristan Harris sits down with China experts Selina Xu and Matt Sheehan to separate fact from fiction about China's AI development. They explore fundamental questions about how the Chinese government and public approach AI, the most persistent misconceptions in the West, and whether cooperation between rivals is actually possible. From the streets of Shanghai to high-level policy discussions, Xu and Sheehan paint a nuanced portrait of AI in China that defies both hawkish fears and naive optimism. If we're going to avoid a catastrophic AI arms race, we first need to understand what race we're actually in—and whether we're even running toward the same finish line. Note: On December 8, after this recording took place, the Trump administration announced that the Commerce Department would allow American semiconductor companies, including Nvidia, to sell their most powerful chips to China in exchange for a 25 percent cut of the revenue. RECOMMENDED MEDIA “ China's Big AI Diffusion Plan is Here. Will it Work? ” by Matt Sheehan Selina’s blog Further reading on China’s AI+ Plan Further reading on the Gaither Report and the missile gap Further Reading on involution in China The consensus from the international dialogues on AI safety in Shanghai RECOMMENDED YUA EPISODES The Narrow Path: Sam Hammond on AI, Institutions, and the Fragile Future AI Is Moving Fast. We Need Laws that Will Too. The AI ‘Race’: China vs. the US with Jeffrey Ding and Karen Hao Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.